Coastguards of Yesteryear - Discussion Forum

[ Genealogy ]

Hi, Stephen Callen was my direct ancestor on my father's side so would love to contact you and find out more about him. I have details of his marriage and a sketchy idea of his parents and wife's family at St Issells.

[ Genealogy ]

Alex Glennie is recorded in 1841 Scotland census in Peterhead occupation Coast Guard Service married to Elizabeth and two children - eldest Thomas is 2 yrs old.

The 1841 census has Alex born about 1816 but in 1851 Census he is born abt 1813.

[ Genealogy ]

Welcome to the Forum.

There was an Alexander Glennie stationed at Peterhead between Sept. 1838 and Dec 1849, just to confirm Noreen's statement that Max's father was also a Coastguard. Alexander joined the CG service in February 1833, giving his place of birth as Aberdeen, and that he was single.

Martin

[ Genealogy ]

ohhh my grandfathers. being tracing them for awhile and kept getting stuck on father/grandfather of Max being either Alex or william

would love hear from some of youse to draw a tree up correctly

Merged on 30/01/2012 15:59:53:
@ downa yes Isabella was my great grandfather's sister, her name appears on one form witness think my granny's birth or baptism cerf.

UPDATED:
name: Maximilian Adolphus Glennie
gender: Male
baptism/christening date: 14 Jan 1847
baptism/christening place: PETERHEAD,ABERDEEN,SCOTLAND
birth date: 26 Dec 1846
father's name: Alexander Glennie
mother's name: Elizabeth Watson

think i got this right :)

[ The Records Database Project ]

Welcome to the Forum Phil.

You're very specific about looking for baptism details, is there some other detail you are looking for that might be available from another source?

Martin

[ Genealogy ]

James at the Mouth of Boyne looks more and more like the father.

Came across a memorial record for John David Sumner RN at this website

http://www.ulsterwarmemorials.net/html/portaferry__county_down.html

which ties a lot of my McCullen's together.

[ The Records Database Project ]

I'M LOOKINH FOR ANY DETAIL OF MABEL ALEXANDRIA SUTHERLAND, WHO'S FATHER JOHN SUTHERLAND SERVED IN CG IN TRAMOSE Co WATERFORD UPTO 1904, WHEN MABEL WAS BORN, SOME THREE WEEKS AFTER JOHN WAS POSTED TO DINGLE Co. KERRY WHERE HE TOOK THE FAMILY. I'M IN TERESTED IN TRACING BAPTISM DETAILS OF MABEL?
PHIL

[ Genealogy ]

James served in Cork after service during WW1. He had been shipwrecked of the Coast of Scotland.
His nephew also served as S.P.O. after WW1.
James was a relative of mine also.
His brother served in the British Army in WW1 and lived in Douglas near James. I knew them both.

[ Genealogy ]

Hi Martin,
I recall a family conversation some years ago now when I was told that one of "our Bridle boys" in Ireland had received a medal for services in Crimea war. By chance I recently found the pertinent record and image of record can be tracked via Ancestry/UK, Naval medal and Award Rolls 1793-1792 but of course, I needed to confirm just which of the JW's it referred to.

Thanks again, Izzey

[ Genealogy ]

Thanks Izzey, I can now correct my database re JWBs 1. age. Can I ask how did you manage to establish this so quickly?

Martin

[ Genealogy ]

It would appear that J.W.B 1 served as boatman on H.M.S Gladiator 1855/56 and was awarded a Baltic Medal, to CG at Kinsale 23/4/ 1857. (JWB2 served with "Eliza"from1853-1857.) And JWB3 would still have been just a "twinkle in his Dads eye" at the time of the Crimean War!

[ Genealogy ]

Hi Izzey

I'm pleased that the information was of interest.

One of the attractions of a man becoming a Coastguard was the ability to keep his family with him. In JWB Snrs time most men lived in rented accommodation, it was only in the 1860's that there was a major building programme of CG accommodation linked to the Stations.

Your assumption that Eliza was a Revenue Cruiser is correct. If you wished to try and trace her movements your best bet is to consult her Muster Book at the National Archives (ADM 119/36), unfortunately this can only be done in person.

Similarly if you wanted to know more about JWB Snrs career in the Navy, which commenced in 1821, you should order his pension application online from the National Archives (ADM 29/73/444 also ADM 29/50/73). Using their online ordering facility this takes about 3 weeks. If this were to confirm his entitlement to the Baltic Medal I would be grateful if you could let me know.

I note that Ellen Harris' father was a John Harris (familysearch.org). There was a John Harris working as a Coastguard in Kinsale District. Given the number of men who married into other CG families, I would not mind betting this is another instance, although I do conceed that Harris is quite a common name.

If a can be of any further help please come back to the Forum.

Martin

[ Genealogy ]

Martin, I cannot thank you enough for your patience and time in searching through all those records to try to sort out the confusion. I had no idea how I was going to find the records for JWB (1st ) and we have only been able to piece together some of the information from the dates and places of birth of his children. So to receive all the detailed information you sent re his naval service is fantastic. Many many thanks. It does seem likely that he would have retired sometime after 1871 because I have not found him on census then but he appears, retired,on 1881 census, living in Penzance with his family and there he died in 1890. It is interesting to note that his 4 sons, all pursued R.N careers. Would it have been customary for wives and families to move with husbands' postings? I notice that son, Edwin John born Whitstable in 1845 entered the Greenwich Hospital School in 1855 when the rest of the family was presumably in Ireland.
The Naval records show that JWB (no2) was born on 27th Jan 1835 and this tallies with the family birthday book,but despite attempts to find evidence of this in the parish records for Cornwall (Launceston) nothing has come to light so far. There is a record of a christening in Morice St, Wesleyan Methodist Chapel, Devonport , Plymouth on 2nd Feb 1835 but with birth date 27th Jan 1835 and naming James W (no1) and Jane Bridle as parents. However this child was recorded as William Henry! No further records for this William Henry can be found and JW (no1) and wife Jane had another son named William Henry, born in Dirk in 1851!! Although I never like to make assumptions when tracing family history, it would appear that the name recorded for the christening may have been entered in error! But of course, it has added even more to the confusion!
Your information and picture about JW's medal is quite fascinating and I would be most interested to know how it came your way. It's good to know it is in safe hands.
I understand from the Naval records that in 1856 / 1857, JWB2 was serving on "Eliza". Would this have been a Revenue Cruiser and would you know where he would likely to have been based at that time? I found a record of his marriage to Ellen Harris at ? Rincurran, Kinsale in 1858.
I certainly shall follow up all the leads you have passed on to me, and am absolutely delighted to have found some more missing pieces in the family puzzle, thanks to your help..
I should also like to add that I think "Coastguards of Yesteryear" is an excellent website, offering such a mine of useful information and hints.

Izzey

[ Genealogy ]

Hi Izzey,and welcome to the Forum.

I think I might be able to throw a little light onto your problem, also perhaps the same amount of doubt!

I undertook a research project to identify all those CG's who had served in the Navy during the Crimean War, amongst them was a JW Bridle, who, according to HMS Gladiator's ships description book, was born in Devonport around 1833. His Baltic medal was sent to Kinsale CG District in 1857. The problem for me was that in the CG Establishment Books for this period no JW Bridle was stationed in the district. However, your post has prompted me to look at the other men on Gladiator who received this medal, and a number of them were from Revenue Cruisers not land based CG Stations.

As a medal collector I had previously bought a Naval Long Service Good Conduct medal to a James Bridle born in Launceston in 1835. After some research I found he had entered the CG Service from Revenue Cruisers in the April of 1862. Having read your post I believe the man who received my medal, and the JWB above are the same man, and the reason I could not find him on land is that he was still serving in RC's in 1857.

[b][i]Having now looked at again JWB (1st) I think my assumptions are wrong, and that I made a transcription error re his age. It is in fact he who was awarded the Baltic Medal, because Dirk Cove is in the Kinsale District.[/i][/b]

More importantly for you is that RC JWB first posting as a land based CG was to Arklow. I'm therefore inclined to think that your JWB (2nd) was JWB (3rds) father.

You can view JWB's (2nd) Long Service medal here, awarded in 1875 when rated Chief Boatman in Charge.

[url]http://www.coastguardsofyesteryear.org/articles.php?article_id=257[/url]

I hope this all makes sense. As an aside I once lived in Great Wakering.

Martin

Merged on 19/01/2012 17:34:24:
Izzey you asked about JWB Snrs service. Using the CG Establishments Books I've constructed his CG career.

Nominated from HMS Jupiter (a troop ship) on 27 August 1835, with a first posting to Hastings on 3 Sept. 1835 (ADM 175/6 pdf 196). He was examined at Gosport.
18 Dec.1839 to Tillingham, Essex (ADM 175/6 pdf 671)
8 March 1841 to Whitstable - promoted Commissioned Boatman removed to Tankerton
26 March 1842 to Tankerton (ADM 175/6 pdf 70)
20 May 1846 to Whitenose - reason given 'Ill health' (ADM 175/7 pdf 71)
17 July 1846 to Portland
6 January 1847 to Preston
18 May 1847 to Mousehole (ADM 175/7 pdf 376)
16 February 1850 to Dirk Cove (ADM 175/7 pdf 509) Promoted Chief Boatman in Charge
18 June 1860 to Dunbeacon (ADM 175/19 pdf 120)
12 Feb 1863 to Dirk Cove

After this I cannot find him, but it cannot be long before he was pensioned.

Martin

[ Genealogy ]

I am trying to find evidence of the birth for this Coastguard who was, I believe, the son of another CG James W Bridle and his wife Ellen nee Harris. From records I have found James William Snr had 13 children, mostly born around the coast of Cork.However, I recently came across 2 records for the oldest of the children to have been born around Waterford at Ovaca and Arklow between 1860 and 1864 where I am assuming the family may have lived at that time.I am wondering if any one can advise or point me into the right direction to find out more, please? It is rather confusing as seemingly, there were 3 James W Bridles,possibly all coastguards at irish CG stations.
The first J.W Bridle,son of a Timothy Bridle and his wife Mary, was born 1810 at Dock,Devonport, married Jane Crocker 1834 (Stoke Dameral) died Penzance 1890. He was probably stationed in Kent between abt 1840 -1848 as 2 of his children( Elizabeth Ann and Edwin John) were born at Whitstable. His next posting may have been to Mousehole area as a daughter Hannah Maria was born there in 1849. He then had 2 sons (William Henry and Alfred Carter born 1851 an 1854 respectively)at Dirk, Ireland.
N.B There is some confusion abt the place of birth for the (second) James William. The parish records for Stoke Dameral for this period are not legible and to date there is no record for his birth in Launceston, (which was incidentally the birthplace of his mother Jane.) The naval records state that he was born in Launceston, Cornwall.. The family birthday book records his d.o.b as Jan 27th 1835. This James William (No 2) married Ellen Harrris at Kinsale in 1858 and the 1911 Irish census confirms that he was born in Cornwall in 1835. He died in Dublin in 1912 and his wife Ellen died there too in 1810, also Ellen, a daughter (born 1860).. James and Ellen had 13 children.. Martha Sara, John Henry Allyn, Catherine Georgina, Annie Isabelle all born at Unionhall between 1866 and 1871. Emma Lydia was born 1873 in Skibberean and died in 1882 in Kinsale. Edith Minnie and Alfred Edwin were born 1877/1878 at Waterford and Arthur Ernest was born 25th July 1882 in Kinsale (All the d.o.bs for these children are recorded in a tiny family birthday book lent to me by my nephew). Searching through some irish records recently, I came across an Ellen Bridle born abt 1860 at Ovaca and a James W. born at Arklow, Waterford, and also Rebecca Eliza born 1864 in Ovaca. (By my reckoning I am still 2 children short of the 13 recorded on the 1911 census!) I have a copy of his service history between years 1873 and 1890, serving on ships. Vanguard, Iron Duke, Topaz, and Belle Isle.
Finally James W Bridle No3! Born ?Arklow 1863, married Janet Rose Flower 1895 at Blean in Kent, had 3 daughters.In census 1881 he can be found aboard "Tenedos"1901 he was stationed at Gt Wakering, Essex, 1903 he was at Winterton in Norfolk where daughter Anabel was born, 1904 he was listed as chief boatman at Winterton. In 1911 he was stationed at Ramsgate- 2 daughters, Janet and Kathleen were born at Swalecliffe(1896 and 1897). At some date after this he was transferred to Holyhead , Anglesey where he died in 1935.
Thus it would appear from this lengthy account that there may have been 3 generations of Coastguards in our Bridle family. If only we could find out for certain who the parents of J.W No3 were? And also where to look for a more detailed service record of James W No 1?
Many thanks for taking the time to read this and my apologies for this lengthy epistle but if anyone can advise, I should be very grateful.

[ Genealogy ]

Hi Martin,

Thanks for the information on Stephen Garrett Snr. (1816) when you said 'brought up to the sea', both his sons were down as 'fisher lads' on their service records.

It gets quite confusing working out when he was at sea or ashore, apart from the dates that you gave me the only dates I could rely on were those when he came ashore to have children!

I have pieced together something close to what he may have got up to after leaving HMS Impregnable, I am expecting quite a few of corrections here:-

28 Mar. 1843 AB. HMS Impregnable (appropriate name for what follows)
31 Jan. 1844 Had first son Edward Stephen Jnr. Tyneham.
02 Mar. 1845 Had second son William John. Tyneham.
24 Jun. 1846 Ballygeary.
10 Sep. 1849 Barna.
10 Sep. 1852 Lettermore/Kilkeran.
Mar. 1855 HMS Prince Regent, Baltic/Crimea war.
03 Jun. 1855 Taranrog boat action, Ist. Oct. 1854- 9th. Sept. 1855.
26 Jun. 1856 HMS Royal Albert, 2nd May 1856-22nd Nov. 1856.
05 Jul. 1856 Azoff British Battles date.
18 Apr. 1857 Baltic medal sent to CG District.
18 Sep. 1858 North Isle of Arran.

If I am anywhere near close I will be very happy. I went onto the Tyneham & Worbarrow site (www.tynehamopc.org.uk/tyneham). on which I found their baptisms recorded, one under the name of Garnet. If you go to the section sea and smuggling, they are under the Register of Seamen, just below the Smugglers Roll of Honour.
Well worth a read.

All my ancesters seem to have been tattooed, I was always told that my Grandmothers father was a clergyman only to find out that he was in the RN and CGs Chief boatman in Charge and tattooed with a man and horse on his chest!

I am not sure how much further I can go, I cannot thank the COY enough for all their help, it has been fascinating and great fun.

Phil.

[ Genealogy ]

Hi

I've just returned from a visit to the National Archives, and while there took the opportunity to look at [b]HMS Impregnable's[/b] Ships Description Book (ADM 38/8344). This provided the following information for Edward Garrett Snr:

He was 5' 8 1/2'' tall with blue eyes, light brown hair and with a fresh complexion. He is described as having both arms 'variously tattooed', and with a scar on his right knee, originally being 'brought up to the sea'.

His prior service is shown as follows:

[b]HMS Hastings[/b], Ord, 5 June 34 - 10 Jan 38 - Good
[b]HMS Medea[/b], AB, 23 Feb 38 - 23 Nov 39 - Good
[b]HMS Poictiers[/b], AB, 7 Dec 39 - 15 Oct 40 - Good
[b]HMS Howe[/b], AB/Capt. Coxn, 16 Oct 40 - 27 March 43 - Good
[b]HMS Impregnable[/b], AB, 28 March 43 - no discharge date.

Hope this is of some interest.

Martin

[ Coastguards ]

Query:
When was this watchtower built?
Did it predate the building of the coastguard houses in bunbeg?
Where would one find plans/information re the watchtower?
by seanduine

[ Coastguards ]

John Keane (1814-1852) was my gt.gt.grandfather. He was Command Boatman at Blacksod Point Coastguard Station from 18 March 1848 till his death by drowning, when the coastguard boat overturned, with coastguards Henry Attridge and Cornelius Ward also perishing, on 5 November 1852. He had previously served as Boatman at Mannin Point, and previous to that at Poole Harbour and Eastbourne in England (here he met, and later married Sarah Hide, daughter of head-fisherman James 'Navarino' Hide, on 7 November 1842). A native of County Mayo, John Keane (aka Keine) first went to sea on 21 May 1834 when he joined the Royal Navy (HMS Portland). He later transferred to the Coastguard service.
He left a widow and four small children all under eight years (Charles, Susan, Sarah, & Mary Anne). Sarah returned to Eastbourne, took in dressmaking and raised her four children, dying in 1907 aged 87. As a result of his father's death in service, and in hope of influencing more Eastbourne fishermen to join the navy, the Royal Naval School at Greenwich was 'leaned on' by the Admiralty to accept the eldest, Charles, aged 13. Charles later also died at sea in very strange circumstances--in 1869, aged just 25 (a longboat- full of sailors was taken, apparently, by cannibals off the coast of Africa). John & Sarah's youngest child was my gt. grandmother, the fiery Mary Anne Keane who later married a coastguardman John Castle.
I understand that there is a cairn erected to the memory of these three coastguards. Can someone possibly confirm this as I would like very much to visit the place. I would also like to know where he is buried and if there is any knowledge of his Irish ancestors.
There is, finally, a very mysterious story which has come to us and which I cannot confirm. Perhaps someone can shed some light on this. Apparently, on that fateful day, the coastguards had taken a much-despised English landlord across to some island off Blacksod Point to collect his taxes/rents in these dire times in Ireland. As the coastguard galley was preparing to leave a young woman, heavily pregnant, asked the men for a lift across to the mainland to deliver her baby. The landlord adamantly refused her request and the boat sailed away. But as it did so the young woman caste her shawl over the water and called down a curse on them. Shortly afterwards, in a sudden squall, the boat foundered. Is this a well-known/documented story or has someone kissed the Blarney Stone? John Keane was a kind man with a 'very good' service record and I am very proud to have such a man of such steel and discipline among my ancestors; though, God knows, I feel most unworthy of them.
Don Cormack

[ Genealogy ]

Hi, and welcome to the Forum.

If your man had the Official Number 279381 (this can be confirmed from the medal roll), then there are two sources of information.

The first is his Service Record, which can be downloaded from the NA for �3.50 (link below)

[url]http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/details-result.asp?Edoc_Id=7726807&queryType=1&resultcount=4[/url]

The other is his service card contained in the ADM 175/82B file; this can be downloaded for free from the National Archives website. It only has his CG Service, but does contain dates of birth for children, although not their names.

On your question about rank S.P.O is Stoker Petty Officer, and was his last rank when in the navy.

Martin